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RE: Colappsed maul causes death of Argentinian player

Angus — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 22:10:36 GMT

Good point jonesy and you are probably spot on. I think I must be getting cynical that you never see rucks with players still on their feet these days and assume that it all takes place on the ground

RE: Colappsed maul causes death of Argentinian player

Jonesy — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 16:40:47 GMT

Angus

If the ball was on the floor and the players were on their feet over the ball then suerly it is a ruck?

Jonesy

RE: Colappsed maul causes death of Argentinian player

Angus — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 13:42:40 GMT

Having spent a season coaching in Argentina in 07 I can testify to the fact attacking the legs of players in mauls and trying to tackle them to the ground was common place in our competition with no attempt by referees to curb it

I attempted to protest to them about it for weeks until I finally had to accept it

While the article above says it was not a maul which caused the tragedy but a ruck he does say it was a collapsed ruck which I would interpret to be a maul that was collapsed

Angus

RE: Colappsed maul causes death of Argentinian player

MajorMellons — Tue, 22 Jul 2008 18:17:18 GMT

If you take a look at this....

http://totalflanker.blogspot.com/2008/06/juan-cruz-migliore-rip.html

This is said...

[Quote]
agus said...

Hi guys,

I'm an argentinean rugby journalist -former player also- and i'd like to post a comment about juan cruz's death. first of all, i was watching the match between cuba and san fernando where migliore died. it is a terrible loss because he was such a great kid and had a love for the game far greater than a lot of players.

the day started great for him, because he scored the first try of the match just a few seconds after the start.

the news of his death after he was carried out the field by the medical staff, left his teammates, rivals and everyone -including myself- speachless at the moment. his mother was watching the game and was by his side until the last moment

still, i have to say that he died in a ruck, not a maul. he was cought under five players afer a ruck collapsed on him, but not under a maul.

i'm not deffending the elv's, i just want to set the record streight about juan cruz.

thnks n good luck

ps: sorry about my spelling, my english might be a little rusty
23 June 2008 19:56
[/Quote]

Just so we don't condemn the ELV's before they even start in the uk.
For what it's worth, my opinion is that it may now make the 'legal' collapsing of a maul safer than an 'illegal one, because the players know it will be coming.

RE: Colappsed maul causes death of Argentinian player

Red & Black fan — Tue, 22 Jul 2008 12:26:46 GMT

A tragedy for sure, but I blame coaches & referees...we are the custodians of the game & if we ensure that we:

a) coach approriately, professionally (regardless of the level) & emphasis safety in both technical coaching (HOW to make/ take contact, fall in a tackle, HOW to tackle, scrum, ruck, maul etc) as well as appropriate conditioning (improving/ building neck, shoulder & back + associated joints strength & stability)

b) that referees policy the game appropriately & emphasise safety

then injuries WILL be minimised- look at the reduction in player injury incidence where Unions have introduced safety measures (e.g. www.sharksmart.co.za/ www.rugbysmart.co.nz )

Obviously freak injuries/ accidents will occur- thats life, thats sport, but we CAN minimize them by doing our jobs professionally...if any of you have toured Argentina, you'll know the varying conditions you might experience- we took an U18 team & in one game, we played against 4 (!) teams ranging from U18 through to a mens side over 4 'chukkas' (!!) it was SURREAL! & the competence/ incompetence levels of some of the referees was something to behold! But sadly thats not limited to Argentina/ tier 2, 3 & 4 countries, I've seen some APPALLING refereeing in tier 1 countries too.

We CAN do it- maybe i'm being idealistic, but I believe its possible!

RE: Colappsed maul causes death of Argentinian player

liamjefford — Sat, 05 Jul 2008 04:19:17 GMT

I'm not so much concerned about the piling on after it is pulled down but am more concerned there will be lots more people who have fallen an got caught in the middle underneath a moving maul an they will get trampled in the amateur teams because less people are aware of the rules that you are not allowed to trample a player in a maul or at all for that matter, i mean look at paul o connell against namibia in the 2003 world cup and he is a professional.

RE: Colappsed maul causes death of Argentinian player

didds — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:28:18 GMT

There is no indication of why the maul collapsed. If it was because somebody pulled away the legs of a mauler this would as illegal with the ELVs as it is currently. If it was a complete accident (ie no deliberate activity) then this is no more likely to happen under the ELVs as it is now. The only relevance this tragic accident would have wrt the ELV is if it is understood that the coillapse was because of the IRB sanctioned method ie pulling down from above the waist.

I too share conerns over this ELV but the debate woill not be helped by knee jerk reactions.

didds

Colappsed maul causes death of Argentinian player

Chunky Charvis — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:13:55 GMT

http://planetrugby.com/Story/0,18259,3551_3726061,00.html

I cannot believe the IRB are adamant that the new pulling down of the maul law will not be dangerous.

This happened under the old law not the new one - surely there is a higher chance of this incident happening again if mauls are collapsed even more???

very worried and angry.